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  1. #31

    Re: WTA ATP GS AusOpen 1/14 - 1/27 2019

    Replying to Ponchi: Her actions and the actions of people like her caused me, specifically, much pain in my life. So while I completely understand the argument made by Liam, it will always gall me that there is such an important arena named for her.
    For me, it is not that different from naming an arena in Alabama the George Wallace Arena. The man may have devoted his life to politics and maybe had some worthwhile accomplishments. But he was on many levels quite horrible. Living through what I have in my life, I see horribly homophobic people in that light.

    GH

  2. #32

    Re: WTA ATP GS AusOpen 1/14 - 1/27 2019

    Exactly about the George Wallace Arena. I don't want or need anyone to take away MC's on-court accomplishments. She won those fair and square. But the naming of arenas, courts, etc. are separate from that. That hasn't been earned, it's an honor that is gifted to someone, bestowed upon them in special recognition. It is okay to take into account not just who they were on-court, but who they've been in life. And someone like MC being so heinous is worthy of taking into account.

    While he's nowhere near on the same level, think about how native-ish NY product John McEnroe does not have anything named after him at the US Open where he's won 4 titles. Court naming really is completely apart from on-court accomplishments. It is holding up the person on a completely different level, indicating they are someone who should be revered in some way.

    Also, if you don't rename things, keep up existing ways to honor someone who isn't deserving of it, it's like you're okay with it. So, back to Glenn's example. You keep a place named the George Wallace Arena, I'd just assume I'm not welcome there since you're so committed to honoring him and I sure as **** am not spending one red cent there.

  3. #33

    Re: WTA ATP GS AusOpen 1/14 - 1/27 2019

    Agreed. If I am ever lucky enough to be in Melbourne at the time of the Australian Open, I know it would be very difficult for me to walk into the Margaret Court Arena.

  4. #34
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    Re: WTA ATP GS AusOpen 1/14 - 1/27 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by GlennHarman View Post
    Agreed. If I am ever lucky enough to be in Melbourne at the time of the Australian Open, I know it would be very difficult for me to walk into the Margaret Court Arena.
    Iíd agree if I knew she was making royalties from the ticket sales or something. But if the Open want to name a court after their most prolific champion, I really wonít take that as anything but. Her opinions mean less than nothing to me, it certainly wonít stop me going to watch the tennis if I had the opportunity

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    Re: WTA ATP GS AusOpen 1/14 - 1/27 2019

    The womenís top 8 seeds are through to the third round of a slam since Wimbledon 2009. Thatís TEN YEARS <yikes>

  6. #36

    Re: WTA ATP GS AusOpen 1/14 - 1/27 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by liam_valid View Post
    I’ve never liked her, and I’m a gay man, but I disagree with not having the Court named after her just because she has different views and beliefs to me. She didn’t cheat her way to those titles, she won them fair and square and was the best of her generation. The fact that she is a total idiot off court shouldn’t detract from her achievements
    The questions become, is there such a thing as an intolerable belief, and if so, should you overlook those beliefs to celebrate a person's accomplishments? I don't think so. Which matters more, winning tennis tournaments or not being a homophobe? I say the latter.
    Sometimes you're the windshield, sometimes you're the bug.

  7. #37

    Re: WTA ATP GS AusOpen 1/14 - 1/27 2019

    I think each of us reacts to this based on our own experiences. I will never explain in this forum how much homophobia impacted negatively on parts of my life, but rest assured that it was a huge amount. That is why, at my relatively advanced age, I am not willing to honor people who were, and in Margaret Court's case continues to be, part of a very serious and damaging problem.

    GH

  8. #38

    Re: WTA ATP GS AusOpen 1/14 - 1/27 2019

    Agree. But if we cannot learn from experiences like yours and a lot of other people (racism, xenophobia, political persecution, etc), that usually leads to an impoverished view.
    Remember what I say: one issue with the current political view of the world is the incapability of people to have empathy with other peoples' problems, opinions or situations.
    Starry starry night

  9. #39

    Re: WTA ATP GS AusOpen 1/14 - 1/27 2019

    I know we have greatly veered from the tennis tournament here.....But I will add: The single biggest disappointment of my life has been the realization that people are amazingly capable of being truly horrible to other people. I'm not saying this as a revelation for any of you, needless to say. But that was a really horrible shock to me as I went through my formative years. As children, if possible, we want to believe that people will be nice to us and we will be nice back. The degree to which that is not the case was, as I say, the biggest disappointment. Maybe that explains my amazing closeness to my dogs.....I have seen in each of them the qualities that I wish I saw in people.

    GH

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    Re: WTA ATP GS AusOpen 1/14 - 1/27 2019

    Quote Originally Posted by GlennHarman View Post
    I think each of us reacts to this based on our own experiences. I will never explain in this forum how much homophobia impacted negatively on parts of my life, but rest assured that it was a huge amount. That is why, at my relatively advanced age, I am not willing to honor people who were, and in Margaret Court's case continues to be, part of a very serious and damaging problem.

    GH
    Thatís definitely right. I came out in the mid 90s and can honestly say In all the years since, Iíve had no experience of homophobia at all. So when I hear about this woman frimAustralia who was born into an ultra religious family in a time when homosexuality was illegal, if she doesnít believe in gay marriage, then I wonít invite her to my wedding, simples. I feel bad for people who hold such outdated views but I wonít hate them for it, thatís not in my nature. Unless there is a lot more to the Court story that Iím missing? (Iím gonna have to google her when I finish work)

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