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  1. #31
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    Re: Is Pres Obama set to endorse same sex marriage?

    The hard truth is that the President could help an old lady cross the street--and many would have a problem with it.

  2. #32

    Re: Is Pres Obama set to endorse same sex marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by dryrunguy View Post
    The hard truth is that the President could help an old lady cross the street--and many would have a problem with it.
    BECAUSE SHE'S PROBABLY GOING TO THE SOCIAL SECURITY OFFICE.





    (For reals, go Obama!)

  3. #33
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    Re: Is Pres Obama set to endorse same sex marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by dryrunguy View Post
    The hard truth is that the President could help an old lady cross the street--and many would have a problem with it.
    The same thing could be said about Bush Jr...Clinton...Bush Sr...Reagan...Carter...Ford....

    We take offense when people take exception to the person in office that we like. But we jump on the bandwagon to speak out against the actions when the President (or Congressional leader,...) is one we do not agree with.
    With Lucas Pouille at Indian Wells (2018)

  4. #34
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    Re: Is Pres Obama set to endorse same sex marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moose View Post
    The same thing could be said about Bush Jr...Clinton...Bush Sr...Reagan...Carter...Ford....

    We take offense when people take exception to the person in office that we like. But we jump on the bandwagon to speak out against the actions when the President (or Congressional leader,...) is one we do not agree with.
    I think that's basically true. But compared to congressional history, this president has been blocked more than any other by opponents in congress. I think that has emboldened lay-people to be more vocal with their disagreements. Or maybe it's worked the other way around.

    Filibusters:

    Oh Grigor. You silly man.

  5. #35

    Re: Is Pres Obama set to endorse same sex marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moose View Post
    The same thing could be said about Bush Jr...Clinton...Bush Sr...Reagan...Carter...Ford....

    We take offense when people take exception to the person in office that we like. But we jump on the bandwagon to speak out against the actions when the President (or Congressional leader,...) is one we do not agree with.
    Sounds like tennis fandom, no?


  6. #36
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    Re: Is Pres Obama set to endorse same sex marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moose View Post
    The same thing could be said about Bush Jr...Clinton...Bush Sr...Reagan...Carter...Ford....

    We take offense when people take exception to the person in office that we like. But we jump on the bandwagon to speak out against the actions when the President (or Congressional leader,...) is one we do not agree with.
    Both blind allegiance and blind disapproval are things that should be railed against. I don't believe in either. This President has disappointed me many times. The most recent, I think, was the indefinite detention bill. I just couldn't believe he would actually sign it. I was pretty vocal in criticizing that. Ultimately he ended up striking one of the two provisions I despised, at least I think so. Accurate and trustworthy information has been very hard to come by.

    Actually, there was a more recent one than that--the impending Department of Labor regulations on child farmworkers. Many of the provisions were vague in terms of under which circumstances they applied, and some were downright absurd. Fortunately, after enough public outrage, DOL relented and is working with agricultural groups to refine the regs. Meanwhile, my conservative friends were content to be spoonfed and lied to (in many respects) from Andrew Breitbart's newsletters that made outlandish claims about how these regs would destroy family farms, while those on the left assumed that they must be good regs because they had been developed under this President's watch--and he can do no wrong. Meanwhile, I worked in government long enough to know with fairly decent certainty that he had undoubtedly not read them. Hell, they were 51 pages long.

    I have no problem with people disagreeing with the President or even disliking him, as long as they are working with real facts and aren't approaching an issue with an insurmountable bias.

    Meanwhile, when Paul Ryan finally proposes a federal budget plan that isn't morally repugnant, I'll be the first to laud him publicly.

  7. #37
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    Re: Is Pres Obama set to endorse same sex marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by dryrunguy View Post
    Both blind allegiance and blind disapproval are things that should be railed against. I don't believe in either. This President has disappointed me many times. The most recent, I think, was the indefinite detention bill. I just couldn't believe he would actually sign it. I was pretty vocal in criticizing that. Ultimately he ended up striking one of the two provisions I despised, at least I think so. Accurate and trustworthy information has been very hard to come by.

    Actually, there was a more recent one than that--the impending Department of Labor regulations on child farmworkers. Many of the provisions were vague in terms of under which circumstances they applied, and some were downright absurd. Fortunately, after enough public outrage, DOL relented and is working with agricultural groups to refine the regs. Meanwhile, my conservative friends were content to be spoonfed and lied to (in many respects) from Andrew Breitbart's newsletters that made outlandish claims about how these regs would destroy family farms, while those on the left assumed that they must be good regs because they had been developed under this President's watch--and he can do no wrong. Meanwhile, I worked in government long enough to know with fairly decent certainty that he had undoubtedly not read them. Hell, they were 51 pages long.

    I have no problem with people disagreeing with the President or even disliking him, as long as they are working with real facts and aren't approaching an issue with an insurmountable bias.

    Meanwhile, when Paul Ryan finally proposes a federal budget plan that isn't morally repugnant, I'll be the first to laud him publicly.
    You mean, "because Sean Hannity said so" isn't good enough for you?
    Oh Grigor. You silly man.

  8. #38
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    Re: Is Pres Obama set to endorse same sex marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kirkus View Post
    You mean, "because Sean Hannity said so" isn't good enough for you?
    Ha! That or addictinginfo or thinkprogress, etc.

    Here's an example of how I think we (I'm talking in the broad American public sense) can do it better. Today in the national news thread, I posted the report from Meals on Wheels about hunger among seniors. Now, I heard about this on FB because a friend posted a veracitystew article that summarizes this report and then went on to slam Paul Ryan pretty hard for his "Bombs, not Bread" budget. Now, politicizing it like that (and as I just did by inserting "Bombs, not Bread" makes for great leftist propaganda.

    But it will do nothing to get conservative friends to think about donating to Meals on Wheels or another organization that serves seniors, or to convince them that this perhaps is not the best time to slash and burn the safety net for seniors.

    And that's why I posted the actual report, not the veracitystew article, here and on my FB page.

    We need to start making each other read (or at least skim) the original reports, regulations, and legislation rather than simply relying on others to tell us what it means. Sometimes that's not practical, like the actual ACA health care law. But we're too quick to allow ourselves to be spoonfed by outlets with an agenda. I've been trying to practice this more myself, and I'm already quite surprised how many times I've responded to a post with something like, "Read that report. It doesn't say what [insert outlet or name of the group] says it says."

  9. #39
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    Re: Is Pres Obama set to endorse same sex marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moose View Post
    The same thing could be said about Bush Jr...Clinton...Bush Sr...Reagan...Carter...Ford....

    We take offense when people take exception to the person in office that we like. But we jump on the bandwagon to speak out against the actions when the President (or Congressional leader,...) is one we do not agree with.
    I hear this argument and it's just an excuse. I don't buy this argument at all because I've never seen it to this extent before.

    I mean, Bush Jr.'s Senior Prescription drug program as an example. Excellent program. Good for him. We didn't disagree with it simply because a Republican signed it into law.

    And Laura Bush? Everybody liked her.

    But, now, we have downgraded ourselves to the point where Michelle Obama's campaign to fight childhood obesity is considered communism or something.

    It's become crazy.

  10. #40
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    Re: Is Pres Obama set to endorse same sex marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by shtexas View Post
    And Laura Bush? Everybody liked her.
    Bill Maher called her "Hitler's Dog". Whole lotta "like" there.
    Last edited by Moose; 05-10-2012 at 01:44 PM.
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  11. #41
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    Re: Is Pres Obama set to endorse same sex marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moose View Post
    Bill Maher called her "Hitler's Dog". Whole lotta "like" there.
    Wait a minute! You can't quote Maher just because I quote Hannity!
    Oh Grigor. You silly man.

  12. #42
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    Re: Is Pres Obama set to endorse same sex marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moose View Post
    Bill Maher called her "Hitler's Dog". Whole lotta "like" there.
    Bill Maher is not a good example. He's there to be crude.

    I'm not pointing to anyone in particular. I think I've been guilty before too. But, I've seen Maher pop up in a few different discussions here and I find it odd. He's there to entertain. I accuse FOX and MSNBC watchers with confusing opinion shows (which are really entertainment) with news. I think we've done some of that around here.

    Look at the so-called Democratic strategist who attacked Romney's (why do I always mistype his name as "money" and have to correct it?) wife. Correct me if I'm wrong, but she doesn't speak for the administration, does she? Yet, everyone acted like she did.

  13. #43
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    Re: Is Pres Obama set to endorse same sex marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kirkus View Post
    Wait a minute! You can't quote Maher just because I quote Hannity!
    Haha.

    To be honest, I'd like to lock the both of them in a room with Hitler's actual dog (assuming it was a rotty or like breed).

    About the only "opinion-talker" I can tolerate these days is Anderson Cooper. Intelligent, (relatively) unbiased, and histrionic-free. No wonder he's at the bottom of the ratings pile.
    With Lucas Pouille at Indian Wells (2018)

  14. #44
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    Re: Is Pres Obama set to endorse same sex marriage?

    Ugh. I can tell from my writing that my attempts to stay calm this election season will not be successful.

  15. #45
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    Re: Is Pres Obama set to endorse same sex marriage?

    Quote Originally Posted by shtexas View Post
    Ugh. I can tell from my writing that my attempts to stay calm this election season will not be successful.
    Heh. I got into an FB argument last night with a friend--a middle-aged Caribbean male and a ferocious supporter of Romney--who posted this: "I know we love to boast that President Obama is a black man and that is why you support him. So can you tell me what the Prez has done for the black community. Please refer me to the programs and in detail what the President has implemented or done for the black community. Whose first?"

    I got to accomplishment #13 (I figured I knew of about 40-50 off the top of my head) before he basically told me to STFU. LOL!

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