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  1. #7936

    Re: World News Random, Random

    Zach Moller �� ��

    Americans acting all high and mighty about the UK parliament Mace incident need to remember we do it too #AmericanMace

    Mr. Moller doesn't say what happens if a miscreant is presented with the mace and continues to act up.
    "Even if you dance for your enemy on the rock, he will accuse you of splashing water on him." ~ African Proverb

  2. #7937

    Re: World News Random, Random

    Back to serious discussion of British politics:

    Hugo Rifkind @hugorifkind

    Here follows a Brexit thread.
    The thing is, the best way to understand Theresa May’s predicament is to imagine that 52 percent of Britain had voted that the government should build a submarine out of cheese.

    Now, Theresa May was initially against building a submarine out of cheese, obviously. Because it’s a completely insane thing to do.

    However, in order to become PM, she had to pretend that she thought building a submarine out of cheese was fine and could totally work.

    "Cheese means cheese," she told us all, madly.

    Then she actually built one.

    It’s shit. Of course it is. For God’s sake, are you stupid? It’s a submarine built out of cheese.

    So now, having built a shit cheese submarine, she has to put up with both Labour and Tory Brexiters insisting that a less shit cheese submarine could have been built.

    They’re all lying, and they know it. So does everybody else. We've covered this already, I know, but it’s cheese and it’s a submarine. How good could it possibly be?

    Only she can’t call them out on this. Because she has spent the past two years also lying, by pretending she really could build a decent submarine out of cheese.

    So that’s where we are.

    On balance, I this analogy works fine, perhaps except for the submarine and cheese parts, which need a little work.

    Thread ends.
    "Even if you dance for your enemy on the rock, he will accuse you of splashing water on him." ~ African Proverb

  3. #7938

    Re: World News Random, Random

    One should however consider the other side too. EU is not an empire, if you wish to get out of it you should be able to. Of course you don't get to keep the same trade privileges, but that's another story. In fact it's Ireland which messes everything up here. Without that issue Brexit, while perhaps still misguided, would be a pretty straightforward affair.
    Roger forever

  4. #7939

    Re: World News Random, Random

    I am so going to use that shit cheese submarine analogy as soon as I get a project again. It so applies to our industry.
    Starry starry night

  5. #7940

    Re: World News Random, Random

    BBC Newsnight
    ‏Verified account

    Senior Tories are frustrated by how much power Ireland has had in the Brexit negotiations, especially over the backstop, says our political editor Nick Watt.

    "The Irish really should know their place," one said
    "Even if you dance for your enemy on the rock, he will accuse you of splashing water on him." ~ African Proverb

  6. #7941
    Everyday Warrior MJ2004's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008

    Re: World News Random, Random


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  7. #7942

    Re: World News Random, Random

    The Irish should really know their place. Right. Independence. Kind of an idea they have had for a long time.
    Starry starry night

  8. #7943

    Re: World News Random, Random

    Quote Originally Posted by ponchi101 View Post
    The Irish should really know their place. Right. Independence. Kind of an idea they have had for a long time.
    I was hospitalized before my daughter was born. One of my room mates was a woman whose family lived on Sutton Place (still a very ritzy part of Manhattan). She had gone into early labor and the drugs they used at that time to stop the contractions made you feel over heated. Her family wasn't satisfied with the care the nurses were giving so they hired a private duty nurse who sounded as if she'd just arrived from Ireland. To say they treated her badly doesn't begin to describe how they treated her. This statement brought me back to how that young woman was treated.
    "Even if you dance for your enemy on the rock, he will accuse you of splashing water on him." ~ African Proverb

  9. #7944

    Re: World News Random, Random

    Dana Regev
    ‏Verified account

    CONFIRMED: #Strasbourg shooting toll rises to two dead, 11 critically wounded, @AFP reports; Gunman was known to police for criminal activity.
    3:57 PM - 11 Dec 2018 from Cologne, Germany

    Malcolm Nance
    ‏Verified account

    More Malcolm Nance Retweeted Dana Regev
    Based on video victims were shot at 55 Rue due Grande Arcades in front of Adidas. This is a major pedestrian st about 2 blocks down and 3 blocks over from the Catherdral where the main Christmas Market is located. I know it well. it’s on a pedestrian way near Place Kebler/FNAC.

    This was done on foot/bike or Moto because cars are turned further down street. I’ve always seen numerous 4 man French Army Operation Sentinelle foot patrols closer to the market. This feels like a criminal beef or a target of opportunity attack. Direction of action will tell
    "Even if you dance for your enemy on the rock, he will accuse you of splashing water on him." ~ African Proverb

  10. #7945

    Re: World News Random, Random

    Terrible coincidence that on the same day we posted that Strasbourg was the third best Xmas destination in Europe, this attack happened.
    Since this was in Europe (not the USA). Any doubts about the perpetrators?
    Starry starry night

  11. #7946

    Re: World News Random, Random

    Quote Originally Posted by ponchi101 View Post
    Since this was in Europe (not the USA). Any doubts about the perpetrators?
    Not in France, I'm afraid...
    Roger forever

  12. #7947

    Re: World News Random, Random

    Ponchi, I was literally a bit stunned at the coincidence when, late yesterday, I read about the Strasbourg Christmas Market incident.


  13. #7948

    Re: World News Random, Random

    5 Takeaways About Theresa May’s (Sort of) Victory
    By Benjamin Mueller
    Dec. 13, 2018

    Mrs. May won. But it might not be much of a victory.

    More than a third of her own party wanted someone else leading the Brexit process. That was especially sobering because about half of Conservative lawmakers also hold paid government posts of some sort; Mrs. May’s critics were quick to argue that she would have lost handily without the support of this “payroll vote.”

    There’s something else they were quick to recall, too: In 1990, a far more formidable Conservative prime minister, Margaret Thatcher, was forced to step down within days of defeating a leadership challenge by 204 votes to 152.

    The party’s rules were very different then, however: Mrs. Thatcher was headed for a second, more bruising round of balloting, while Mrs. May is now immune from further Conservative Party votes for a year.

    And if we have learned one thing about Mrs. May these last years, it’s that she will not quit. With a little more than three months before Britain’s membership of the European Union is scheduled to expire, she does not think the country can afford a change in leadership.

    Still, her power has rarely looked so tenuous.

    Her victory came at a cost.

    The prime minister bargained away her long-term political future to ensure she would survive the no-confidence vote, promising Conservative lawmakers that she would step down before a general election set for 2022.

    It was an emotional retreat for Mrs. May, and a victory for Conservative colleagues who chose her as leader not to help them win elections but to finish the thankless task of navigating Britain’s departure from the European Union.

    It leaves open the question of whether Mrs. May will lead future stages of negotiations, when Britain will have to hammer out long-term trading arrangements with the bloc.

    That wasn’t the only drastic measure Mrs. May took in pursuit of the clearest possible victory. She also reinstated two Conservative members of Parliament who had been suspended over allegations of sexual misconduct.

    Her Brexit deal looks as dead as ever.

    A vote against Mrs. May’s leadership was effectively a vote against her agreement on leaving the European Union. (Her government is doing little else at the moment.)

    So we can now assume that at least 117 members of her party are ready to vote against the plan. Her working majority — including that small Northern Ireland party, which is also strongly opposed to her plans as they stand — is 13. Without help from the opposition Labour Party, whose leaders are angling for an early general election or a second public referendum on European Union membership, a crushing defeat would be certain.

    Mrs. May called off a vote on Monday to forestall that outcome, and the arithmetic has not changed. To win over moderates in opposition parties — perhaps a less risky idea now that she’s immune to right-wing challenge — she would have to offer a softer Brexit that would preserve more trading ties with the European Union.

    But that would mean Mrs. May crossing the negotiating “red line” that she perhaps considers most important: gaining the power to close Britain’s borders to citizens of European Union countries.

    A trip to Brussels probably won’t save her.

    European leaders will greet any attempt to rewrite the 585-page, legally binding withdrawal agreement with a resounding no. They refuse to abandon a so-called backstop arrangement that at least temporarily keeps Britain in a customs union with Europe to avoid a hard border between Northern Ireland, which is part of the United Kingdom, and Ireland, which is a member of the European Union.

    That measure is anathema to the right wing of the Tory party, which regards it as a ruse to permanently render Britain a “vassal state,” beholden to the bloc’s rules and regulations with no say in them and no plausible way to escape.

    While refusing to abandon the backstop, European leaders have said they are willing to offer some assurances to Mrs. May: something along the lines of a nonbinding text saying the backstop arrangement will not be long-lived. But that does not seem likely to placate the most fervent Brexit supporters.

    Avoiding chaos might require delaying Brexit.

    If Parliament does nothing before March 29, Britain’s relationship with the European Union will rupture overnight. Banking, trade, travel, food, medicines, the fluid border between Ireland and Northern Ireland — all would be thrown into flux.

    The pro-Brexit right wing of the Conservative Party has long dismissed forecasts of chaos and economic dislocation, dismissing them as products of a pro-Europe fear campaign. But their failure to oust Mrs. May and replace her with one of their own means it’s now less likely that Britain will deliberately leave without a deal.

    A no-deal exit is still the default outcome. Mrs. May seems to hope delaying the vote in Parliament, in all likelihood until mid-January, will pressure enough lawmakers into supporting her plan. But many analysts doubt that ploy will work.

    The chances are increasing, then, of another option that Mrs. May has sought to rule out: throwing the question of European Union membership back to the public in a second referendum.

    Doing that would raise another array of questions: What choices would be on the ballot? What if the result is as close as the first?

    The only certainty in that scenario is that Britain would have to ask for an extension on the March 29 deadline.
    "Even if you dance for your enemy on the rock, he will accuse you of splashing water on him." ~ African Proverb

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