Page 5 of 121 FirstFirst 123456789153055105 ... LastLast
Results 61 to 75 of 1809
  1. #61
    Grand Slam Champion missinandre's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Norfolk, VA
    Posts
    9,120

    Re: Let's Discuss Religion.

    I'm loving this thread. I am reading EVERYONE's post and love all the different beliefs and so many possibilties for sooooooooo many hot discussions. I am waiting until I have time to...sit at the computer and actually type something. Things are just too busy right now and I'm always exhausted. But I wish....everyone participates in this discussion.
    ROGER / RAFA FINAL 2010 US OPEN!!!!!

  2. #62
    Forum Director
    Forum Moderator

    Awards Showcase

    123 GO Champion, Ball Of Madness Champion, Solitare Champion, National Treasure Pinball Champion, Midi Golf Champion, Yeti Sports 8- Jungle Swing Champion, Base Jumping Champion, Putt it in Golf Champion, Yetisports 10 - Icicle Climb Champion, 247 Mini Golf Champion, Flash Golf Champion, Battleship Champion, Yeti 1 Greece Champion, Archery Champion dryrunguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    South Central PA
    Posts
    45,181
    Blog Entries
    11

    Re: Let's Discuss Religion.

    Quote Originally Posted by missinandre View Post
    No.
    See? I find that curious. I read a book many years ago (can't tell you the author, but he was a respected theologian... The book was simply entitled "God")... It wasn't an easy read. But the premise of the book was that God continues to change and adapt and his priorities for his people change. For example, in the early part of the Old Testament, God was a God of War. Basically, God was rather genocidal where the enemies of his people were concerned. But in the later Old Testament, he was a source of comfort for his people as they were dominated by the Babylonians and others... And then in the New Testament, he became the God of love, the God of compassion, and the God of personal redemption.

    It's a fascinating read. And I must admit, I left the book completely bought into the notion. I like the idea that God, well, for the lack of a better term, evolves. And even those who believe in a literal translation of The Scriptures must admit that God underwent quite a metamorphosis during the course of Biblical history. If you take it at face value.

    I was just curious what you thought.
    Gender should never be a death sentence. http://www.facebook.com/The.Worldwide.War.on.Girls. A civilized nation doesn't tolerate violence against women. http://www.facebook.com/TheSilenceStopsNow?ref=hl. Microlending harbors tremendous potential to improve the economic, social, political, and educational empowerment of women and children. https://www.facebook.com/pages/Globa...417742?fref=ts

  3. #63

    Re: Let's Discuss Religion.

    Quote Originally Posted by dryrunguy View Post
    Missin (et al), do you believe God changes? That God has changed with time?
    Nah, but I don't think of God in a "typical" way.

    I think God is simultaneously synonymous () with two things: Mother Nature and the Soul.

    If a problem works itself out in an way that I didn't expect it to, or I luck my way into something, I think of God as Mother Nature. The general conciousness of the universe was looking out for me. It didn't want me to have a lousy life. I also sometimes think of God in a karmic sense. Everyone is going to end up with an equal lot in life. Some will have much, much more difficult lives then others, but they might be more enlightened, they might have experienced a wider range of the possibilities life can give. I personally think my life is a bit more of a roller coaster than many, but that it still balances out. I had an unhappy childhood and a few horrific family members, but I'm also lucky enough to be wildly talented () and am blessed in a lot of ways.

    I think of God as the Soul in the sense of praying for guidance or finding inner, unknown strength. Conscience would also work. God as the soul/conscience is something that we aren't always in contact with. In times of struggle, we reach out to that source of strength and guidance.

    I don't think too many "average" Christians would mind my Mother Nature/Soul/Conscience descriptions of God, but the part where I deviate from the mainstream is that I don't believe in the miracles of the Bible, Jesus as the Messiah, or the conventional afterlife. If you look at the Bible chronologically, there are more and more miracles and "Jesus as Christ" references the later it gets. If you look at the cultural history of the region, there are very good reasons why the authors would want to emphasize miracles and "Jesus as Christ."

    I think the miracles and Messiah focus used by many Christians distracts us from the important messages. Maybe the miracles did happen literally, but I find that totally irrelevant. Jesus shouldn't have to be partially inhuman and totally infallible for us to follow his teachings. If you think they're a good way to lead your life, then follow them. There should not be an "if." To me, following the teachings of Jesus "as long as he's the Messiah" seems like too much of a business transaction.

  4. #64
    Forum Director
    Forum Moderator

    Awards Showcase

    123 GO Champion, Ball Of Madness Champion, Solitare Champion, National Treasure Pinball Champion, Midi Golf Champion, Yeti Sports 8- Jungle Swing Champion, Base Jumping Champion, Putt it in Golf Champion, Yetisports 10 - Icicle Climb Champion, 247 Mini Golf Champion, Flash Golf Champion, Battleship Champion, Yeti 1 Greece Champion, Archery Champion dryrunguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    South Central PA
    Posts
    45,181
    Blog Entries
    11

    Re: Let's Discuss Religion.

    Charlie, I have no problem with the idea that God can be different things to different people. Though I'm sure some would. One could argue that's the essence of the delusion... He is what we WANT him to be. (And please forgive me for using "he/him" terminology; I believe God transcends gender.) It's a self-fulfilling thing.

    But for me, I'm not aware of any rule suggesting that another individual's personal experience has to match my own. All I know is that my experience and my journey has been real. I'm sure others with different experiences would say the same, and I'm not about to cast any doubt about the "realness" of someone else's journey.
    Gender should never be a death sentence. http://www.facebook.com/The.Worldwide.War.on.Girls. A civilized nation doesn't tolerate violence against women. http://www.facebook.com/TheSilenceStopsNow?ref=hl. Microlending harbors tremendous potential to improve the economic, social, political, and educational empowerment of women and children. https://www.facebook.com/pages/Globa...417742?fref=ts

  5. #65

    Re: Let's Discuss Religion.

    Quote Originally Posted by dryrunguy View Post
    See? I find that curious. I read a book many years ago (can't tell you the author, but he was a respected theologian... The book was simply entitled "God")... It wasn't an easy read. But the premise of the book was that God continues to change and adapt and his priorities for his people change. For example, in the early part of the Old Testament, God was a God of War. Basically, God was rather genocidal where the enemies of his people were concerned. But in the later Old Testament, he was a source of comfort for his people as they were dominated by the Babylonians and others... And then in the New Testament, he became the God of love, the God of compassion, and the God of personal redemption.

    It's a fascinating read. And I must admit, I left the book completely bought into the notion. I like the idea that God, well, for the lack of a better term, evolves. And even those who believe in a literal translation of The Scriptures must admit that God underwent quite a metamorphosis during the course of Biblical history. If you take it at face value.

    I was just curious what you thought.
    My grandmother would agree with you. She's said very close to the same thing.

    Still, I don't think God changed that much in biblical times. I think the author's emphasis changed. The Old Testament may have seemed mroe warlike because the author's lived in a land occupied by foreign soldiers. They needed their people to stay faithful and not interbreed with the soldiers. They couldn't openly circulate anti-government propoganda, but they were allowed to have religious activities. So, conveniently, all the religious sermons had to do with God smiting enemies, as long as everyone stayed faithful to the church.

    As for the New Testament, the Jesus portrayed in Mark and Matthew was NOT particularly friendly. In fact, he was rarely friendly. He spent a lot of his time yelling at everyone, apostles included. Later versions of Jesus' story became more and more friendly, as did translations by the church. The attempts to harmonize the different Jesus stories ended up creating a "buddy Jesus," the peaceful hippie we learn about in Church. A scholar's translation of Mark, the first written gospel, depicts a very angry Jesus. In Mark, Jesus was an angry revolutionary, who wanted to fix Judaism, not create a new religion. His family thought he was crazy, and only his apostles were able to see his miracles, because God was purposely clouding everyone else's mind.

  6. #66

    Re: Let's Discuss Religion.

    Quote Originally Posted by dryrunguy View Post
    Charlie, I have no problem with the idea that God can be different things to different people. Though I'm sure some would. One could argue that's the essence of the delusion... He is what we WANT him to be. (And please forgive me for using "he/him" terminology; I believe God transcends gender.) It's a self-fulfilling thing.

    But for me, I'm not aware of any rule suggesting that another individual's personal experience has to match my own. All I know is that my experience and my journey has been real. I'm sure others with different experiences would say the same, and I'm not about to cast any doubt about the "realness" of someone else's journey.
    Did I? If so, it wasn't my intention.

  7. #67
    Director of Nothing
    Forum Moderator

    Awards Showcase

    mmmm8's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    New York, New York, United States
    Posts
    44,552

    Re: Let's Discuss Religion.

    Quote Originally Posted by dryrunguy View Post
    See? I find that curious. I read a book many years ago (can't tell you the author, but he was a respected theologian... The book was simply entitled "God")... It wasn't an easy read. But the premise of the book was that God continues to change and adapt and his priorities for his people change. For example, in the early part of the Old Testament, God was a God of War. Basically, God was rather genocidal where the enemies of his people were concerned. But in the later Old Testament, he was a source of comfort for his people as they were dominated by the Babylonians and others... And then in the New Testament, he became the God of love, the God of compassion, and the God of personal redemption.

    It's a fascinating read. And I must admit, I left the book completely bought into the notion. I like the idea that God, well, for the lack of a better term, evolves. And even those who believe in a literal translation of The Scriptures must admit that God underwent quite a metamorphosis during the course of Biblical history. If you take it at face value.

    I was just curious what you thought.
    Dry, I'm just wondering. If you believe G-d evolves, how do you know to rely on him/her/it? I mean, in some way, you must have some sort of expectations or belief in G-d's intentions or actions. How do you keep those expectations if G-d changes?

    I'm not sure I phrased that clearly...

    I think it's an interesting concept you propose. Obviously, different parts of the Bible portray G-d differently, but I didn't think of an "evolving" G-d



    P.S. I guess I'm more Jewish than I thought - automatically spelled our "G-d"


  8. #68
    Forum Director
    Forum Moderator

    Awards Showcase

    123 GO Champion, Ball Of Madness Champion, Solitare Champion, National Treasure Pinball Champion, Midi Golf Champion, Yeti Sports 8- Jungle Swing Champion, Base Jumping Champion, Putt it in Golf Champion, Yetisports 10 - Icicle Climb Champion, 247 Mini Golf Champion, Flash Golf Champion, Battleship Champion, Yeti 1 Greece Champion, Archery Champion dryrunguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    South Central PA
    Posts
    45,181
    Blog Entries
    11

    Re: Let's Discuss Religion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie02123 View Post
    Did I? If so, it wasn't my intention.
    Not at all. Quite the opposite.
    Gender should never be a death sentence. http://www.facebook.com/The.Worldwide.War.on.Girls. A civilized nation doesn't tolerate violence against women. http://www.facebook.com/TheSilenceStopsNow?ref=hl. Microlending harbors tremendous potential to improve the economic, social, political, and educational empowerment of women and children. https://www.facebook.com/pages/Globa...417742?fref=ts

  9. #69

    Re: Let's Discuss Religion.

    Quote Originally Posted by mmmm8 View Post
    Dry, I'm just wondering. If you believe G-d evolves, how do you know to rely on him/her/it? I mean, in some way, you must have some sort of expectations or belief in G-d's intentions or actions. How do you keep those expectations if G-d changes?
    Well, I don't particularly endorse the changing God theory, but I suppose I should if I think of God as linked to humans, and human thought does change over time.

    Anyhoo, I would think that the theory would involve God doing whatever was appropriate at the time. If the state of the world needs a warlike God, then welcome to Smite-town. If the world needs a friendly Messiah, then hope there are Lamaze classes in Bethlehem. I feel like the theory would have God becoming whatever the world needed God to be.

  10. #70

    Re: Let's Discuss Religion.

    Quote Originally Posted by dryrunguy View Post
    Not at all. Quite the opposite.
    Oh good. I was worried there for a second.

  11. #71
    Forum Director
    Forum Moderator

    Awards Showcase

    123 GO Champion, Ball Of Madness Champion, Solitare Champion, National Treasure Pinball Champion, Midi Golf Champion, Yeti Sports 8- Jungle Swing Champion, Base Jumping Champion, Putt it in Golf Champion, Yetisports 10 - Icicle Climb Champion, 247 Mini Golf Champion, Flash Golf Champion, Battleship Champion, Yeti 1 Greece Champion, Archery Champion dryrunguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    South Central PA
    Posts
    45,181
    Blog Entries
    11

    Re: Let's Discuss Religion.

    Quote Originally Posted by mmmm8 View Post
    Dry, I'm just wondering. If you believe G-d evolves, how do you know to rely on him/her/it? I mean, in some way, you must have some sort of expectations or belief in G-d's intentions or actions. How do you keep those expectations if G-d changes?

    I'm not sure I phrased that clearly...

    I think it's an interesting concept you propose. Obviously, different parts of the Bible portray G-d differently, but I didn't think of an "evolving" G-d



    P.S. I guess I'm more Jewish than I thought - automatically spelled our "G-d"
    I guess I'm talking about God changing over a large spectrum of time. I think Charlie makes a great point about author interpretation. It makes perfect sense.

    The kind of thing that I'm talking about would be, for example, that in early society, God was big on procreation. He wanted the society of his people to grow. But today, I'm betting God would be more of an advocate of intelligent procreation in the sense that priorities have changed? Does that make any sense?

    Maybe that's not a great example. It's the only one I could come up with on the spot. Maybe someone else has a better example.

    Here's a better example! In ancient times, God would have been a fan of The Bryans. The world needed stability. But today, he's rooting for Nestor/Zimonjic... Just because it's the right thing to do and the Bryans have had their day.
    Gender should never be a death sentence. http://www.facebook.com/The.Worldwide.War.on.Girls. A civilized nation doesn't tolerate violence against women. http://www.facebook.com/TheSilenceStopsNow?ref=hl. Microlending harbors tremendous potential to improve the economic, social, political, and educational empowerment of women and children. https://www.facebook.com/pages/Globa...417742?fref=ts

  12. #72
    Forum Director
    Forum Moderator

    Awards Showcase

    123 GO Champion, Ball Of Madness Champion, Solitare Champion, National Treasure Pinball Champion, Midi Golf Champion, Yeti Sports 8- Jungle Swing Champion, Base Jumping Champion, Putt it in Golf Champion, Yetisports 10 - Icicle Climb Champion, 247 Mini Golf Champion, Flash Golf Champion, Battleship Champion, Yeti 1 Greece Champion, Archery Champion dryrunguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    South Central PA
    Posts
    45,181
    Blog Entries
    11

    Re: Let's Discuss Religion.

    Quote Originally Posted by Charlie02123 View Post
    Oh good. I was worried there for a second.
    What I meant by that line was that I respect the fact that your experience is different. It's no better, no worse. It's just, well, different. And that's totally cool.
    Gender should never be a death sentence. http://www.facebook.com/The.Worldwide.War.on.Girls. A civilized nation doesn't tolerate violence against women. http://www.facebook.com/TheSilenceStopsNow?ref=hl. Microlending harbors tremendous potential to improve the economic, social, political, and educational empowerment of women and children. https://www.facebook.com/pages/Globa...417742?fref=ts

  13. #73
    Director of Nothing
    Forum Moderator

    Awards Showcase

    mmmm8's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    New York, New York, United States
    Posts
    44,552

    Re: Let's Discuss Religion.

    Quote Originally Posted by dryrunguy View Post
    Here's a better example! In ancient times, God would have been a fan of The Bryans. The world needed stability. But today, he's rooting for Nestor/Zimonjic... Just because it's the right thing to do and the Bryans have had their day.
    Dry, I'm ready to accept your G-d as my G-d!!!



    Yeah, you answered the question. I was just wondering if it affects your personal daily relationship
    (With G-d, not the one with Mary Carillo )


  14. #74

    Re: Let's Discuss Religion.

    For me, God doesn't change over time. God has always wanted what's best for His creation, and just because that changes doesn't mean God changed.

    But my belief is extremely general. Besides believing that He wants what's best for His creation, my overriding belief regarding God is that no human can even begin to understand His essence or motivations. I would find it incredibly presumptuous to think that I could guess what God wants, so I don't attempt to determine the details of His nature.
    B*tch, please

  15. #75

    Re: Let's Discuss Religion.

    Quote Originally Posted by mmmm8 View Post
    P.S. I guess I'm more Jewish than I thought - automatically spelled our "G-d"
    "Would a rose by any other name..."

    TANGENT TIME!

    There was a brief time this summer when I was pondering speaking at my college's Christian organization (FCA). I wanted to use a simple math thing (property? theorem? I forget what it is.) to explain my thoughts on God and Jesus.

    If a=b, and b=c, then a=c.

    So say you believe Jesus or God is the true path to salvation. Jesus=God=Salvation.

    What else is God? God is love. God is patience. God is kindness. God is forgiveness. God is truth.

    So then, all of those things are ALSO a path to salvation.

    Love=Salvation
    Patience=Salvation
    Kindness=Salvation
    Forgiveness=Salvation
    Truth=Salvation

    My main point was that there's no need to worry about who belongs to your church and who doesn't. Whoever is following a path of love, or patience, or anything you consider God to be, is following a path to salvation just like you are. They may be calling that path Judaism or Mormonism or Buddhism or Islam, and their path may look a little different then yours, but it will end up in the same place.

Page 5 of 121 FirstFirst 123456789153055105 ... LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  



Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v4.2.1